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Author Topic: [BEAKL] Balanced Effortless Advanced Keyboard Layout  (Read 350616 times)

iandoug

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Re: [BEAKL] Balanced Effortless Advanced Keyboard Layout
« Reply #2000 on: 2020-Oct-13 14:51 »
Just a pointer to a relatively new python based keyboard analyser which can be found here..

https://github.com/bclnr/kb-layout-evaluation

The current codebase does not handle the thumb row (and, hence, space key) and layers, so it is somewhat basic. But the config file is quite readable and allows defining a finger roll penalty scheme. The delault weighting scheme is based on the ColemakDH dev page so favours the more traditional QWERTY layout alternatives, with BEAKL in the running but downstream from MTGAP. Basically, any layout is better than QWERTY and its variants (unsuprisingly), the differences numerically not being that far apart.

Plugging in BEAKL weightings, of course, pushes BEAKL layouts to the top. The code is in python so is easily modifiable for the interested (I added a thumb row to see how my "thumb I" BEAKL variant would fair against BEAKL 15 and it holds its own).

Anyway, thought some of you might be interested in this code base since you could extend it to accommodate the rules and evaluation schemes of import to you (eliminating the ambiguity of how other analysers work).

I haven't taken a deep dive into the code to determine how the corpus is defined and processed (but it appears to use a pre-processed bigram count file vs processing a sample text file.. so a parser would be in order to run random files against this program).

Mmm.. that's the second in recent times to promote Colemak DH. It also is (IMHO) rather optimistic as to the pinky's strength ... it's easy to pick values based on gut feel, but some science behind the choices would be better.
The generous pinky is the real reason that Colemak, with 3rd AND 4th most common letters on pinkies, comes out well.

A while back a pair of researchers took a similar approach with bigrams. But I think there's a fatal flaw in the logic ... (apart from ignoring space and punctuation)... we don't type bigrams in isolation, but as part of words and sentences. So what comes before and after the bigram is just as important. The layout they came up with was not very good.
http://scholarworks.rit.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=1729&context=article

Analysis here:
https://www.keyboard-design.com/letterlayout.html?layout=light-anderson.en.ansi    (one glance should reveal how ridiculous it is)

My improvements:
https://www.keyboard-design.com/letterlayout.html?layout=light-anderson-mod-Ian.en.ansi
https://www.keyboard-design.com/letterlayout.html?layout=light-anderson-mod-Ian-2.en.ansi

In truth, the analyser I am pondering also uses bigrams, coupled with actual character frequencies. Getting those values was the whole point of the recent "corpus" exercise... to get 97² bigrams. Now I need to figure out how to use them without falling into the same trap.

Here's another attempt which takes more things into account.
https://github.com//mw8//white_keyboard_layout

Analysis of his generated layout is here:
https://www.keyboard-design.com/letterlayout.html?layout=white.en.ansi

Above analysis was done with KLA original and Den1, both rather different to KLATest.

Cheers, Ian




Tomdraug

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Re: [BEAKL] Balanced Effortless Advanced Keyboard Layout
« Reply #2001 on: 2020-Oct-13 17:00 »
Mmm.. that's the second in recent times to promote Colemak DH. It also is (IMHO) rather optimistic as to the pinky's strength ...
I completely agree. One of the reasons, why I embraced BEAKL 15 is the pinky A moved to index. I love it

I consider BEAKL 15 the easiest layout to learn, because of logical arrangement of letters, which other layouts lack completely.
Good example is (“) or vowels in cluster. I created my own left hand numpad layout following the same logical idea:
 654
3210
 987
I’m pretty sure it is suboptimal, but it allowed me learn quickly and use.

Thank you for great work on BEAKL!


moesasji

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Re: Here we go again...
« Reply #2002 on: 2020-Oct-15 04:27 »
Attached two layouts which do well at most things English. They struggle a bit if there are a lot of numbers, but I would probably switch to numpad for those in real world.

I would use the simpler version myself, because I put a lot of other non-ANSI stuff on AltGr. The AltGr version is to compete more directly with other new layouts, especially for code.

Ian: the thing that for me looks really uncomfortable in this layout is the "you", which is a pretty common trigram. I can't type that without taking all my fingers of the homerow, i.e. I need to let go for the pinky as well to type this.

As you've put a relatively rare key on the CAPS position: is there a reason/logic why don't you use that position for a letter to allow you to keep the p on that side? Something like this that seems to score pretty similar and gets another common key used as a CTRL + character on that hand and would avoid making the you trigram uncomfortable?

iandoug

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Re: Here we go again...
« Reply #2003 on: 2020-Oct-15 05:18 »
Ian: the thing that for me looks really uncomfortable in this layout is the "you", which is a pretty common trigram. I can't type that without taking all my fingers of the homerow, i.e. I need to let go for the pinky as well to type this.

As you've put a relatively rare key on the CAPS position:

And here I thought the Emacs/Vim users would like that position. (I use neither but I see occasional rants about Esc and backtick.)

Regarding you/puo ... it works okay on my MS Natural, but I use my pinky on the y in those cases so it's not such a contortion. My pinkies are only two joints long. An ergolinear design may be more awkward.

I did try the you idea, since it does seem "obvious" but the numbers tell a different story.

Code: [Select]
op 675095
Op 12,039
OP 5,595
oP 179 692,908

po 942,847
Po 59,929
PO 6,729
pO 10 1,009,515

up 452,679
Up 6,410
UP 3,375
uP 72 462,536

pu 293,713
Pu 17,547
PU 2,724
pU 46 314,030 2,478,989

yo 443,288
Yo 76,197
YO 3,608
yO 10 523,103


oy 131,686
OY 1,226
Oy 361
oY 3 133,276

uy 18,500
UY 296
Uy 66
uY 0 18,862

Yu 4,304
yu 2,775
YU 156
yU 13 7,248 682,489

Combinations with p-o-u are 4 times as many as y-o-u. Results from the recent corpus exercise.

It's basically you/your/boy/buoy versus put up poor pungent opportunity, oppose popular poop punish etc.

Cheers, Ian

moesasji

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Re: Here we go again...
« Reply #2004 on: 2020-Oct-15 06:22 »
I did try the you idea, since it does seem "obvious" but the numbers tell a different story.

Not sure I follow you here as I did put the P back with the T on the other hand. I did not swap Y and P. In any case you hitting the Y with your pinky makes sense as putting it below the H was indeed something that crossed my mind as a potential solution. That scores worse though....

btw) for Emacs putting the X right next to the Alt is a pretty big no-no.

iandoug

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Re: Here we go again...
« Reply #2005 on: 2020-Oct-15 06:32 »
Not sure I follow you here as I did put the P back with the T on the other hand. I did not swap Y and P. In any case you hitting the Y with your pinky makes sense as putting it below the H was indeed something that crossed my mind as a potential solution. That scores worse though....

btw) for Emacs putting the X right next to the Alt is a pretty big no-no.

Emacs issue noted :-)

I was looking at it from the perspective of "which is better next to ou ... p or y?"

I will play more with KLA once we get some feedback from Den ...

Cheers, Ian


iandoug

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Seelpy
« Reply #2006 on: 2020-Oct-17 15:58 »
Hi

Two people tested the Seelpy layout ...

=======================================================

About a month ago, a discord user by the name of Richa and I published our conclusions on the keyboard-layout "Seelpy". Specifically, we learned an adaption of the layout "Seelpy 1.4". Richa and I wrote up our experiences, and we posted them on the Deskthority forum. I am sending you this Email because you, as the developers / designers of the Seelpy layouts, might be interested in reading about empirical thoughts on your theory.

This is Richa's post: https://deskthority.net/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=24535
This is my post: https://deskthority.net/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=24536

================================================================

Cheers, Ian

moesasji

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Re: Seelpy
« Reply #2007 on: 2020-Oct-18 05:24 »
Two people tested the Seelpy layout ...

Make that at least three. I've typed on it for about three weeks or so and I came to the same conclusions.....it looks great on paper, but it is just way to difficult to type on fast as I couldn't get much above 30 WPM either. I think it comes from making rolls just way too difficult. Prime example is things like typing "the"

Tomdraug

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Re: [BEAKL] Balanced Effortless Advanced Keyboard Layout
« Reply #2008 on: 2020-Oct-18 14:35 »
I got some layout frenzy - I tested beakl 15 whole week. My typical workflow is vim editing, writing new code in python JS SQL and some docs in Polish (where I have Z as the most frequent consonant) So, I rearranged 15 a bit and tested on KLE. For my own comfort it is great. What do you think?
« Last Edit: 2020-Oct-18 14:41 by Tomdraug »

 

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