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2020-Sep-28 12:33

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May. 09 2020 - 10:02am
Awesome, happy to be back on the forums !
I hope everyone is in good health.
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May. 01 2020 - 6:54pm
new domain: ieants.cc
Den:
Mar. 20 2020 - 2:40am
possible delay of service
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Mar. 14 2020 - 1:05pm
@Den
Hey, had some issues opening the Worksheet in the new MS-Excel. Made a topic about it.
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Mar. 07 2020 - 12:19pm
@Den 
You are awesome, this helps a lot !  Really appreciate your help.
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Mar. 07 2020 - 4:07am
.tbl file and translation program
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Mar. 05 2020 - 10:44pm
@Den Wow friend, you are blazing with these updates ! Question, how did you edit the names of things ?
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Mar. 03 2020 - 1:21am

Recent Posts

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1
Keyboards and Other Interfaces / Re: Went back to the drawing board ....
« Last post by moesasji on Yesterday at 04:44 PM »
On the import dialogue, select Tab as separator, and make sure string delimiter is set to nothing.

That did the trick! Thanks!

I need to look in more detail when I have time, but the first impression is that for the first time explains why the brackets score so much better when they are on the hand that has 'hiea', including why putting the '(' on my 'i' key scores better than on my 'e', which never made sense for me.

btw) to display this data as bitmap you can always rescale to a 0-255 scale; but the key thing you really want to see is which ones are low and which ones are high and that is difficult to spot when just looking at numbers. The approach by thinqu where he/she split it into separate tables worked well for me (the ones under same finger movement here: https://microexploitation.com/2018/06/26/the-development-of-the-thinqu-keyboard-layout-factors-that-influence-typing-effort/)
2
Keyboards and Other Interfaces / Re: Went back to the drawing board ....
« Last post by iandoug on Yesterday at 04:31 PM »
I'll just be lazy and wait for the plots. ;)

I have been thinking about those ... issues I have are the size (97 x 97 is a lot bigger than 27 x 27), and what sort of gradient ... eg is a 5% step okay or do we need a 1% step ... or 100/255 step.

This tool does it, but since most of the values are in low single digits or < 1, that detail gets lost ...

http://www.herethere.net/~samson/php/color_gradient/?cbegin=FFFFFF&cend=330033&steps=100


Mmmm might work better with 4 colours, each doing 25% in 1% steps.

3
Keyboards and Other Interfaces / Re: Went back to the drawing board ....
« Last post by iandoug on Yesterday at 04:07 PM »
LibreOffice does something weird as I don't see a 2D array; probably one of the symbols is messing up the import. I'll just be lazy and wait for the plots. ;)

On the import dialogue, select Tab as separator, and make sure string delimiter is set to nothing.

4
Layers are somewhat like chording. it's definitely a different paradigm, that could run counter to familiar techniques like rolls. and likely require more practice to perfect.
5
Keyboards and Other Interfaces / Re: Went back to the drawing board ....
« Last post by moesasji on Yesterday at 02:52 PM »
.tsv == tab separated values, Excel/LibreOffice should handle fine.

LibreOffice does something weird as I don't see a 2D array; probably one of the symbols is messing up the import. I'll just be lazy and wait for the plots. ;)
6
Keyboards and Other Interfaces / Re: Went back to the drawing board ....
« Last post by iandoug on Yesterday at 11:52 AM »
Let me see if I can get the spreadsheets done.

Attached.

.tsv == tab separated values, Excel/LibreOffice should handle fine.

The rawfollow files are basically bigrams used to generate the -follow- and -precede- files.

Also the char frequency files included.

At some point when doing this I had issues with the chars I was using for space, enter and tab ... can't remember if it was PHP being silly or MySQL being pedantic. So different chars used depending on file.

§ or ⍽ is space
¶ or ⮠ is enter
¬ or ⭲ is tab

For -follow- and -precede- files, in English check "qu" and "ex" ... that will help you wrap your head around the numbers. Or see the two image grids a few messages above as a partial guide.

Have fun.

7
Keyboards and Other Interfaces / Re: Fixed and variable costs
« Last post by moesasji on Yesterday at 09:01 AM »
More physical effort, though I was wondering if there is more mental effort as well. On the the other hand, once it becomes hard-wired like ctrl-c or ctrl-t then maybe it's a moot point...

As someone who uses the AltGr layer and actually tried to learn one of the Seelpy layouts I think the problem comes down to loosing the rolls when having to switch between layers. Easiest way to see that problem is if you need to hit a modifier to access a key for the second key in a trigram. You need to be absolutely sure that you've hit and released the first key before pressing the modifier and the next key or you get garbage...the effect is that the layer switch tends to slow you down (but less than having to use hard to reach keys).

Unfortunately really difficult to capture and quantify this

8
Keyboards and Other Interfaces / Re: Went back to the drawing board ....
« Last post by moesasji on Yesterday at 08:42 AM »
Last such exercise was at end of 2017, though it doesn't feel so long ago.
https://www.keyboard-design.com/best-layouts.html
But that has averages rather than per-test.

Personally I think it is best to be able to see the breakdown per type of text to be able to optimize as for example the writing style of academic texts or a piece of code is very different from an email. I don't think you can simultaneously optimize for all use-cases.

edit) this one: https://www.keyboard-design.com/best-layouts-interactive-explorer.html only applies to layouts that have been uploaded; you can't use it to tweak your own.
9
Keyboards and Other Interfaces / Re: Fixed and variable costs
« Last post by moesasji on Yesterday at 08:34 AM »
Each use of modifiers already incur extra penalty to finger usage scores, and sometimes same finger or same hand.

Also you're implying home keys should have no advantages? The entire concept of home keys is moot?

For clarity I was commenting on the two formulas that Ian was posting. The other one was: (finger penalty for actual char) × (distance) + (finger penalty for shift) × (distance) + (finger penalty for AltGr) × (distance).

For that formula you get zero penalty when your fingers rest on the key even though you need to press two keys instead of one for a single character ... this formula would hence favor having a key on the AltGr layer on the home-row over having that same key on something like the Qwerty E position and in my opinion that can't be right as someone who makes heavy use of the AltGr layer. Applying some penalties for all keys, including the ones on the home-row and modifiers that are under the thumb would fix that and allow to tweak the penalty in such a way that "easy" keys on the main layer are favored.

btw) fully agree that the home-row and homeblock are prime positions to use.

10
Keyboards and Other Interfaces / Re: Went back to the drawing board ....
« Last post by iandoug on Yesterday at 08:27 AM »
Last such exercise was at end of 2017, though it doesn't feel so long ago.
https://www.keyboard-design.com/best-layouts.html
But that has averages rather than per-test.

Idiot. Forgot about this:

https://www.keyboard-design.com/best-layouts-interactive-explorer.html
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